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DSI:::Endlighten Acrylic and IR LED Strips from Environmentallights.com Tests
Posted: 02 March 2009 08:41 PM   [ Ignore ]
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So I received my Endlighten acrylic last Friday and some IR lights from Environmentallights.com.  I did a ton of tests so read through the stuff below.

Recieving the Endlighten:
Probably the worst packaging job Id seen ever.  Like one of those shows where they show you how messed up an item looks after shipping it, that’s how the acrylic looked.  The very thin paper covering and thin layer of bubble wrap did little if anything to protect the expensive acrylic.  Corners were heavily chipped and most of the sides were exposed.

IMG_1462.jpg
IMG_1463.jpg
IMG_1465.jpg
IMG_1466.jpg
IMG_1464.jpg

Removed packaging (iphone for size reference) It is about 42” diagonal in a 16:9 ratio:

IMG_1472.jpg

Brought my LED-LP LCD table over below the Endlighten acrylic and some normal, clear 6mm acrylic:

IMG_1473.jpg

Looking down at the LCD image with both pieces splitting half the image (Endlighten on right and normal on left):

IMG_1474.jpg
IMG_1475.jpg

The pictures above are a little dark, but I could not tell any difference between the two acrylics in terms of clarity.  They both looked exactly the same.  Thus I think it is highly likely that a DSI LCD setup will work just fine.
Next I placed my projector below the two sheets and used normal computer paper as a diffuser for testing (again, Endlighten on right and normal acrylic on left):

IMG_1477.jpg
IMG_1480.jpg
IMG_1478.jpg
IMG_1479.jpg
IMG_1476.jpg

Again I couldnt tell any difference, except that the particles inside the Endlighten diffused the image a little, so that without a diffuser, it seemed like you may not need a diffuser, since the particles stop the image, whereas the clear acrylic let the image go straight through.

On to the Environmentallights.com IR Lights.
I received a reel of 850nm IR LEDs:

IMG_1469.jpg

and a test strip of 940nm IR LEDs:

IMG_1468.jpg

The LEDs look like this close up:

IMG_1471.jpg

And the 850nm ones glow a slight red which is only slightly noticeable when the lights are completely off:

IMG_1470.jpg

With my ps3 camera that had a floppy disk poor-man’s band pass filter, here is what the 850nm LED lights look like:

850nm.jpg

and what the 940nm ones look like:

940nm.jpg

The floppy disk isnt filtering for a specific wavelength, but as you can see, the 850nm IR LEDs produce a much brighter image.
I also took a similar picture of a flourecent lamp in my room, with a floppy disk band pass filter:

light_florecent_floppy.jpg

And a 850nm band pass filter:

light_florecent_850BP.jpg

Quite a difference.

Next I did some tests.  First I used the 6mm clear arylic and wrapped the 850nm ribbons all the way around:
IMG_1467.jpg
850nm_FTIR_clearacrylic.jpg
850nm_FTIR_clearacrylic_blobs.jpg

The LED strips from environmentallights.com are really easy to use.  Took me all of 5 mins to surround the acrylic.
The 940nm strip was too short to surround the entire piece of acrylic, so I did a test surrounding the clear acrylic with both wavelengths and only around as much as the 940nm length was and with the floppy disk as the band pass filter.
The 850nm:

850nm_FTIR_clearacylic_blobs_floppy.jpg

And the 940nm one:

940nm_FTIR_clearacrylic_blobs_short.jpg

Not too much of a difference with the floppy disk on, but with the proper band pass filter it would make a big difference.  Again, the 940nm is less as bright due to the ps3 cam’s sensor being less sensitive.

Then I surrounded the Endlighten Acrylic with the full 850nm strip and setup the PS3 cam with the 850nm band pass filter:
IMG_1481.jpg
overview.jpg
test_EnL_full.jpg
IMG_1482.jpg

Very light pressure:

test3.jpg

And dragging with light pressure (peace):

drag.jpg

The setup so far works great and I am very excited.  The Endlighten coupled with the lights from Environmentallights.com created the DSI setup very well and very easily, as everything was setup in under 10 minutes.

Here is the url for buying the reel of 850nm IR LEDs from environmentallights.com

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Posted: 02 March 2009 09:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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LOL lovin the way they packed that acrylic! Can’t believe you paid $207.00 for 4 strips of LEDS thats rediculous. But as you said in Gchat it looks more “Professional” haha. Loving the blobs look nice and clear the acrylic looks pretty good as well beside the big chip in the corner of it lol. What’s the dragging like on acrylic you got some kind of compliant layer on it?

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Posted: 02 March 2009 09:48 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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With DSI, no compliant layer needed (http://nuigroup.com/?ACT=28&fid=2&aid=2512_hO39QsJUFzMYf3mtnXlG).  DSI acts like Rear DI, where the IR light is emitted from the acrylic itself, and not from emitters below the acrylic.  Thus like in Rear DI, you dont need a compliant layer.  I am going to top the Endlighten acrylic with a diffuser and some durable acrylic or glass, that way I can put cups and stuff on it since it will be in my livingroom (http://nuigroup.com/?ACT=28&fid=2&aid=2521_gDEVQlvfBfq3JLIUZeXF)

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Posted: 03 March 2009 12:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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Okay. Now I’m really wanting some Endlighten! The whole compliant layer thing is making me crazy so I would rather do without.

What will the sandwich look like? From the bottom up will it be, diffuser, endlighten, and glass (or what have you)? Or will it be some other order?

And the diffuser will be pulling double duty as a projection surface, right?

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Posted: 03 March 2009 12:09 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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Yes the diffuser is also going to be the projection layer.  See the link in my post right above yours: http://nuigroup.com/?ACT=28&fid=2&aid=2512_hO39QsJUFzMYf3mtnXlG It shows the layering.

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Posted: 03 March 2009 12:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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Cool. So how thick is the Endlighten, 10mm? How rigid is it compared to other acrylics?

Have you figured out how thick the glass will be?

Do you think the diffuser will need to be stretched and/or held down in any way? Or does it seem the weight of the glass will hold it down well?

Of course you might not know yet, but I’m guessing you might have some ideas. Thanks for sharing all this great stuff you are figuring out.

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Posted: 03 March 2009 01:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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The EndL acrylic is 3/8 inch.  Some people have said it is softer than most acrylics, but as far a rigidity, it seems very strong.
The top layer for my setup is still being decided.  Im looking at some durable acrylic that doesnt scratch as it would not shatter like glass would.
The diffuser all depends on what type you want to use: some are clothlike and need to be stretched, whereas some are like stiff paper that just get fastened down with tape or sandwiched between layers.

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Posted: 03 March 2009 06:46 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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Hi! Very nice work there Peau! Thanks for sharing!
Getting the rest of my leds this week and i´ll test some more for myself. “Some durable acrylic that doesnt scratch” sounds like a good toplayer on a table. Would be good for me too cuz of the little once that hopfully will play with this table alot. Glad everything works nice with the endlighten, with the clarity and such. Im really looking forward to seeing more of this and getting my own setup in shape for some real testing. Wuhuu! grin
Gotta find some big LCD-matrix too. Are you going with projection or are you sticking with the LCD-dream? grin

EDIT: Btw, wtf did the company think of when packing your endlighten? Did you get some money back or will you get a new sheet? They sure did a better job when packing mine thats for sure. Im kinda glad. grin

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Posted: 03 March 2009 09:17 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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Hi PeauProductions. You said “I couldnt tell any difference, except that the particles inside the Endlighten diffused the image a little”. Whether the endlighten arcylic is unnecessary. Could you try to useing normal arcylic and tell us the result.

BTW. How much your endlighten arcylic?

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Posted: 03 March 2009 10:33 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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My package arrived the same (brown paper over bubble wrap), except with a nice slash down the back of it. The acrylic itself did come with a tough sheet of protective plastic wrap over it (or else it would have been worse) but mine still sustained chipped edges, as well as a tiny chip in the glass face and a tiny scratch.  Overall, very unimpressed with packaging (apparently done by Staples). 

The lesson is when shipping 20lb of acrylic glass: bubble wrap + paper = insufficient.  This should have been wrapped in a few layers of ridged cardboard.

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Posted: 03 March 2009 10:43 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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peau, quick question:  did you polish the edges of the Endlighten or just use the raw cut edges?

we just got our 60x80 sheet from proplastics yesterday and it was also packaged poorly and beat
all to hells.  we have used other screen from dalite and rp visual which come packed in a plywood
crate, i cant believe they shipped these in what amounts to a cardboard envelope.

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Posted: 03 March 2009 12:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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Yeah guys, the shipping sucked.
I got my acrylic in the recent bulk USA order for a little under $200.
I am going to go with a projector for now, though a future LCD setup with other pieces of Endlighten are still possible.
I did not polish the edges other than the machine polish they did when they originally cut it.  I am going to flame polish it when I’m making a more permanent setup.

Nick Yin:: The Endlighten is definitely necessary. I was simply commenting on the fact that the clarity of the Endlighten makes it still able to be used in an LCD setup.  And I did do tests with the clear acrylic, see the first post pictures.

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Posted: 03 March 2009 01:38 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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Thanks, this helps a lot in understanding what the fuss is all about surrounding endlighten

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Posted: 03 March 2009 02:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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PeauProductions - 02 March 2009 08:41 PM

So I received my Endlighten acrylic last Friday and some IR lights from Environmentallights.com.  I did a ton of tests so read through the stuff below.

The pictures above are a little dark, but I could not tell any difference between the two acrylics in terms of clarity.  They both looked exactly the same.  Thus I think it is highly likely that a DSI LCD setup will work just fine.
Next I placed my projector below the two sheets and used normal computer paper as a diffuser for testing (again, Endlighten on right and normal acrylic on left):


IMG_1477.jpg
IMG_1480.jpg
IMG_1478.jpg
IMG_1479.jpg
IMG_1476.jpg


Here is the url for buying the reel of 850nm IR LEDs from environmentallights.com

I am confused, did you use a projection surface on top or below the endlighten or does it work as a projection surface. I would like to use the endlighten but only if it can be used as a projection surface, as to eliminate rosce.

Thanks,

William

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Posted: 03 March 2009 03:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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peau, did your Endlighten have any branding on it whatsoever?  my packing slip basically says Acrylite FF and
thats it.  im also not getting any joy given a quick test illumination.  we have 850nm leds at a half-inch spacing
and cannot see anything thus far.

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Posted: 08 March 2009 07:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]
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I want to apologize for the packaging guys, i left it with staples who assured me it would be packaged correctly.  Setup looks great peau, Im glad there was no major damage. Again im sorry for the poor packaging staples did.  I should have stayed at staples while they packaged it.

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