im about to order my endlighten (when its in stock again hopefully by march) so i had some time to compare the datasheets of each endlighten version. i also searched the wiki and checked peau’s blog.

after comparing several dsi setups (here and on other sites) imho its a matter of illumination. there can be no general recommendation which is just size related. evonik recommends XL (8-10mm) for screensize up to 51” and XXL (10mm) up to 78” but what if all four sides are illuminated with led strips (im going to use the new 390 led strips)…

@goran, @dennda ..... all othe DSI builders - are you just illuminating from two sides?

heres the XXL brochure (btw none of peau’s brochures include XXL )
http://www.plexiglas-shop.com/pdfs/en/232-19_P_EndLighten_en.pdf

as you can see there is also no data on the luminance of XXL and their examples just show two sided illumination… ???
XXL contains the most reflective particles and therefore has the best transmission - but with more particles it has to have a higher density and therefore not just propotionally improve the luminance… for example i checked the latest XXL datasheet again and found the attached samples:

(A0 table is almost my table size)

Frame Size PLEXIGLAS® Type Luminance @ half-frame / frame center
DIN A3 (420 x 300 mm)b L, 8 mm 223 / 218
DIN A0 (1190 x 840 mm)c XL, 8 mm 579 / 551

the L table (1260cm²) is illuminated with 1560lumens and transmits 218 lumens to the center..
the 800% (9960cm²) bigger XL screen gets ~93% more light (3500) but transmits 150% more light to the center!!

i assume (according to the shown samples) XXL will be the best choice for my setup...mainly because im going to have bright led strips on all sides and deliver enough illumination for XXL. but im confused why evonik doesnt use four sided illumination?

I am using a sheet of XL @ 43″ x 27″ and am quite happy with the brightness I am getting. I am illuminating from all 4 sides with the 390 strips from environmental lights. Some photos are at the project link in my sig.

I would guess that evonik does not show 4-sided illumination because endlighten is mostly used for signage and other architectural work where the sheet is not fully framed.

the_goat - 22 January 2010 10:42 PM

im about to order my endlighten (when its in stock again hopefully by march) so i had some time to compare the datasheets of each endlighten version. i also searched the wiki and checked peau’s blog.

after comparing several dsi setups (here and on other sites) imho its a matter of illumination. there can be no general recommendation which is just size related. evonik recommends XL (8-10mm) for screensize up to 51” and XXL (10mm) up to 78” but what if all four sides are illuminated with led strips (im going to use the new 390 led strips)…

@goran, @dennda ..... all othe DSI builders - are you just illuminating from two sides?


heres the XXL brochure (btw none of peau’s brochures include XXL )
http://www.plexiglas-shop.com/pdfs/en/232-19_P_EndLighten_en.pdf

as you can see there is also no data on the luminance of XXL and their examples just show two sided illumination… ???
XXL contains the most reflective particles and therefore has the best transmission - but with more particles it has to have a higher density and therefore not just propotionally improve the luminance… for example i checked the latest XXL datasheet again and found the attached samples:

(A0 table is almost my table size)

Frame Size PLEXIGLAS® Type Luminance @ half-frame / frame center
DIN A3 (420 x 300 mm)b L, 8 mm 223 / 218
DIN A0 (1190 x 840 mm)c XL, 8 mm 579 / 551

the L table (1260cm²) is illuminated with 1560lumens and transmits 218 lumens to the center..
the 800% (9960cm²) bigger XL screen gets ~93% more light (3500) but transmits 150% more light to the center!!

i assume (according to the shown samples) XXL will be the best choice for my setup...mainly because im going to have bright led strips on all sides and deliver enough illumination for XXL. but im confused why evonik doesnt use four sided illumination?

I’m using XL 8mm 80x60 with 90 OSRAM SFH485 going around all four sides. Keep in mind that the bigger your sheet is, the more difficult it will be to evenly illuminate it because light gets lost before it reaches the center. I think Peau mentioned some limit in size somewhere that he had determined empirically. I only tested this sheet I have. If you use XXL with more particles inside I imagine that it becomes even more difficult (given the same lighting) because even more light is scattered due to the increased amount of particles.
To be honest, I am not really sold to the DSI concept anymore anyways because I still need the FTIR effect for my setup to work at all. That, however, may just be so due to my DIY IR strips.

"it because light gets lost before it reaches the center.”

thats why i think about buying XXL rather then XL… it has more reflective particles
my question is: does XXL also improve light transmission for smaller screens <51” and result in brighter IR illumination?

i would say YES because their calculation is based on two sided illumination with osram LIGHT led’s
“OSRAM LINEAR Light OS-LM1A-W1-854, 450 mm”
“Recommended lamp spacing for illumination on both sides: 1300 - 2000 mm”

Most of us are using a LED-Frame and lighting from all sides… i think ill stick with the XXL in 10mm even though my diagonal is just 46” especially because ill use the brighter led strips in 6cm deep, silver coated U-frame…

can i add extra illuminators under the endlighten ...just in case ?

"thats why i think about buying XXL rather then XL… it has more reflective particles”
Well yes, that’s what I was saying. It reflects more light OUT of the acrylic before it reaches the center. That is just my theory, don’t take my word for it. I have no scientific results on this.

“can i add extra illuminators under the endlighten ...just in case ?”
Why not? Of course then you’ll run into the usual DI problems (depending on how much light they emit).

i understand. but the datasheet and their sample tables show that XL transmits 150% light more than L ... unfortunately there is no data for XXL but its over-proportional.
theoretically:

Frame Size PLEXIGLAS® Type Luminance @ half-frame / frame center

DIN A3 (420 x 300 mm)b L, 8 mm 223 / 218
DIN A0 (1190 x 840 mm)c XL, 8 mm 579 / 551

double size + double amount of light ( 7000lumens) :

DIN MT 2450 x 1800 mm)d XXL 10mm it THEORETICALLY should transmit at least 200% more light to the center compared to XL...according to their sample table in my first post.

maybe less di-problems if i use two of these:
http://www.environmentallights.com/products/13011/LED_Bar_12_inch_850nm_infrared

im just about to order (except XXL)… did i miss anything?

the u-profile in 40x20x40 (HxWxH) was very hard to find because its silver anodized.

i calculated 5mm spacing between LED and XXL ... is that enough?